Search:  

 
 
   News
newer
story category Push IM Clients Challenge SMS
Who needs to pay 20 cents bi-directionally for 160 bytes?
04:47PM Tuesday Jun 23 2009 by Karl Bode
tags: business · wireless · alternatives
Looking at the big picture long term, it's not hard to see how truly open smart phones on truly open networks could make wireless carriers nervous. Mobile VoIP may someday pose more than a passing threat to wireless voice (if carriers ever stop crippling such apps), while text messaging services may ultimately start taking more serious aim at that the wireless industry's true cash cow: SMS and its huge profit margins. Dan Frommer at Silicon Valley Insider notes that AOL's new AIM client for the iPhone could finally be the start of this shift, given it supports Apple's new push technology:
Click for full size
AOL's new AIM app for the iPhone -- available now in free, ad-supported, and $2.99, no-ad flavors -- is the start. It's the first major IM app for the iPhone's new 3.0 software that includes push notifications. What does that mean? It means that when you receive an IM, no matter what you're doing, the iPhone pops up an alert message and a cue to open the AIM app to reply. Just the way text messages show up on the iPhone.
Aside from regulation, there's nothing a broadband ISP executive (wireless or terrestrial) fears more than being a "dumb pipe," over which other service/content companies profit. The fear of lost revenue is why carriers have fought so hard against truly opening up networks and devices, and generally refer to open networks as some kind of unruly wild west where horrible things roam. Push IM clients won't change things overnight, but they may be an early salvo in a much broader evolution.

Related:
  1. Cricket Unveils New Voice, Data Plans
  2. Fon Starts Exploring Femtocells
  3. Customers Unhappy With Early Clearwire Launches
  4. AT&T To Launch Femtocells Next Week
  5. Clearwire Launching In Chicago October 6
  6. Sprint Says They'll Play Nice With Google Voice
  7. Comcast Launches Wireless Broadband In Philly
  8. Verizon: Droid Tethering Will Cost $30 Extra
Forums » Push IM Clients Challenge SMS
view: topics flat text 
Post a:
vic102482
Premium
join:2002-04-30
Upper Marlboro, MD


2 edits

Ive Long wondered that.......

Why someone wouldnt write an application that would just leverage the email address that is attached to every device. I havent used the AIM one, but if your handle is your phone number that is an even bigger reason to dump SMS.

I would dump texting in a heartbeat. I pay 30 bucks a month for the privelage of sending unlimited texts on AT&Ts network.

Too much money, and AT&T benefits from it because I dont tie up their phone lines with long calls. Win win for those guys.

Also what would be cool is some sort of IM to SMS bridge. You send an IM to a phone@email (555-555-5555@wireless.net) and it shows up on that persons phone as an SMS text (and the person of course having the capabilities to reply back). Then you could dump SMS completly.
--
I tie a rope around my penis and jump from a tree, don't you wanna grow up to be just like me!!!!

ablack6596

join:2005-01-28
Scarsdale, NY

Re: Ive Long wondered that.......

AIM already includes this as do many other IM clients. Sending an IM to a cellphone # with a +1 in front sends the phone a text message.

ReVeLaTeD
Premium
join:2001-11-10
San Diego, CA

said by vic102482 See Profile :

Why someone wouldnt write an application that would just leverage the email address that is attached to every device. I havent used the AIM one, but if your handle is your phone number that is an even bigger reason to dump SMS.
Because when you send notifications that way it's treated as an MMS which at least for Verizon is more expensive. I know this because I would use it quite frequently before. Now that I have nobody texting me it's a different ball game.

Blackberry has a minor workaround in its BlackBerry PIN Messaging. But of course both sides need BlackBerries.
chilibball

join:2008-11-20
Albany
·Verizon Wireless B..
·RoadRunner Cable
·Time Warner Cable
·Time Warner VOIP

This is possible.

AT&T: phonenumber@txt.att.net

T-Mobile: phonenumber@tmomail.net
Sprint: phonenumber@messaging.sprintpcs.com
Verizon: phonenumber@vtext.com
Nextel: phonenumber@messaging.nextel.com

where phonenumber = your 10 digit phone number

Here is for MMS

AT&T phonenumber@mms.att.net

Verizon phonenumber@vzwpix.com

Here is the link i got my info from:
»www.tech-recipes.com/rx/939/sms_···_virgin/
madmathias

join:2008-10-22
Hiram, GA

Re: Ive Long wondered that.......

My company started blocking text messages to our blackberry's, and I've been using email to SMS for a long time now as a workaround. Thanks for posting all the carrier addresses, I was curious what they were other than verizon!

tiger72
SexaT duorP
Premium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
clubs:
·T-Mobile US
·RoadRunner Cable

because they're still sent as SMS messages. On all the IM clients for T-Mobile, at least, they use an IM-to-SMS gateway. You're not limited to 160char, but you get charged for each message as if they were SMS messages.

The exception to this are the googlechat client on the TMO G1 which uses the data connection for IM, and 3rd party Android and J2ME apps which also use data.
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara

linicx
Caveat Emptor
Premium
join:2002-12-03
United State
·CenturyLink

said by vic102482 See Profile :

I would dump texting in a heartbeat. I pay 30 bucks a month for the privelage of sending unlimited texts on AT&Ts network.
Why? I pay a buck to Sprint for a 1000 messages a month and rarely use it.
--
Mac: No windows, No Gates, Apple inside

Mr SMS

@terahop.com

Your idea in last sentence fails because it includes parts of wireless telephony SMS infrastructure, used for the Mobile Terminated and Mobile Originated [SMS/Text] messages. These parts include Base Stations, Cell Site Software, wired networking to MSC, not to mention the out of band channels [DTC or DCCH for GSM/TDMA] used to transmit the SMS control messages and Bearer Data.
visuelz

join:2003-05-01
Brooklyn, NY

Awesome

I just tried this with AIM and it's awesome. Definitely didn't see this as a replacement to text but it's definitely a plus.

tenpin784
I Went To The Dark Side?

join:2001-03-30
New Durham, NH

Re: Awesome

I love it.

Now I can finally get the messages when I am doing something other than being on AIM.

grydlok

join:2004-01-06
Richmond, VA

I use it

I like having it on my Ipod touch.

Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
·AT&T Midwest
·Site5.com
·Comcast

BeeJive also has Push notifications

Check out BeeJive. Works with AIM®/iChat®/MobileMe®, MSN®/Windows Live®, Yahoo!®, Facebook, MySpace, GoogleTalk®, ICQ®, & Jabber.

I haven't used it very much since the new version with Push notifications came out, but its supposed to be good.

»www.beejive.com/iphone/
--
My domain - Nightfall.net

gdm
Premium,MVM
join:2001-06-15
Mchenry, IL
clubs:
·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T CallVantage
·Comcast Digital Vo..
·Comcast

Re: BeeJive also has Push notifications

That's what I use since I have multiple IM accounts. They are having an issue with Yahoo right now. That's because Yahoo did something, messed up pidgin on my desktop as well. When I launched the updated version of Beejive I got a new option in my 3G, 3.0 OS that says enable push notifications.

Gaff
Every Villain Is Lemons

join:1999-09-05
Mineral Wells, TX
clubs:

Re: BeeJive also has Push notifications

The new version of Pidgin fixes the Yahoo issues.

»pidgin.im
--
My PC Gaming Blog
»thegaffadin.blogspot.com

gdm
Premium,MVM
join:2001-06-15
Mchenry, IL
clubs:

Re: BeeJive also has Push notifications

Yeah I saw that on monday.

Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000
Just bought, thanks for the tip.
--
POKE 65495,1

gdm
Premium,MVM
join:2001-06-15
Mchenry, IL
clubs:

Re: BeeJive also has Push notifications

I think it's the best IM client for iPhone, BB's or WM devices.

Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000

1 edit

Re: BeeJive also has Push notifications

Just gave it a spin, push works great! This is the app I needed. Now if I could send pics/vid with Beejive, that would be bitchen.
--
POKE 65495,1

Rob
In Deo speramus, God Bless the USA
Premium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
·Comcast

Re: BeeJive also has Push notifications

said by Bit See Profile :

Just gave it a spin, push works great! This is the app I needed. Now if I could send pics/vid with Beejive, that would be bitchen.
I just read that the next update (next week) will allow you to send pics/vid with Beejive.
--
CheckSite.us | YourIP.us | Reverseip.us

Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000

Re: BeeJive also has Push notifications

That is great news. Most of the people I would be chatting with are on desktops or notebooks anyway. I won't be missing MMS much at all.
--
POKE 65495,1
Skyrunner8

join:2002-01-10
Berkeley, CA

Why haven't phone companies done this already?

Create a new standard IMS (internet messaging service), that does text and multimedia messages, and have it send over their data connection.

Then, the phone company doesn't have to 'buy new network capability' to keep up with the vast number of texts sent over SMS and could still make a high margin off of texts, while lowering the price for everybody (Phone companies for not having to put in more towers, and consumers who won't have to pay $30 for texting).

If one cell phone company did this, they would be able to advertise MUCH lower text messaging costs.
--
-Jeff

Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000

Re: Why haven't phone companies done this already?

Sending messages on the current system costs the telcos virtually nothing. They charge $30 because there are enough suckers willing to pay it.
--
POKE 65495,1

jtudor
Xm 60's On 6 Freak
Premium,MVM
join:2002-12-07
Morganton, NC

Re: Why haven't phone companies done this already?

It's not necessarily suckers so much as it is there is no competition and no other alternative. Either you pay what they charge or you do not text.
--
Best of luck

"Do, or Do not, there is no try!" Yoda


Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000

Re: Why haven't phone companies done this already?

I was saying "suckers" in the view of the telcoms. All of us are suckers to them.
--
POKE 65495,1

atuarre
Here come the drums
Premium
join:2004-02-14
Lake Charles, LA
clubs:

Bleh

What happens when the same person types several messages at once? My experience has been that the last part of the message, or last message is shown. The first either do not show or skip by too fast.

Still prefer my blackberry over my iPhone.

Fast forward to the future - The iPhone3GSFL, the FL means Flash and Light. The iPhone3GSFL, same great speed, twice as bright.

pokesph
It Is Almost Fast
Premium
join:2001-06-25
Sacramento, CA
clubs:
·Comcast

Push IM..

quote:
Aside from regulation, there's nothing a broadband ISP executive (wireless or terrestrial) fears more than being a "dumb pipe," over which other service/content companies profit. The fear of lost revenue is why carriers have fought so hard against truly opening up networks and devices, and generally refer to open networks as some kind of unruly wild west where horrible things roam.
Get used to it.. It is what we ALL, as consumers, want.
--
Webmaster - Steve
- - - - - - - - - - - -
»www.1-gb.net
»www.ppnstudio.com

BillRoland
Premium
join:2001-01-21
Ocala, FL
clubs:

Ummm

I get a notification when somebody sends me an AIM or MSN message on my BlackBerry 8350i, this seems hardly revolutionary?
--
"Don't steal. The government hates competition."
Beyond AM. Beyond FM. XM

gdm
Premium,MVM
join:2001-06-15
Mchenry, IL
clubs:

Re: Ummm

Is that notification via a SMS? Typically most AIM people get notified via SMS when they get a text and AIM is set to the mobile device.

Usually your IM app on a device will time out after so long if you aren't actively using it.

BillRoland
Premium
join:2001-01-21
Ocala, FL
clubs:
·Cox HSI

Re: Ummm

said by gdm See Profile :

Is that notification via a SMS? Typically most AIM people get notified via SMS when they get a text and AIM is set to the mobile device.

Usually your IM app on a device will time out after so long if you aren't actively using it.
No. There's an AIM application that runs in the background. When somebody sends me an IM, I feel it vibrate and/or hear a tone, and see the AIM icon at the top of the screen. Its not SMS at all, and I'm not charged a dime for it outside of the BlackBerry plan, its all packet data.
--
"Don't steal. The government hates competition."
Beyond AM. Beyond FM. XM

wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace

join:2004-08-07
New York, NY
·Verizon FIOS
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·RoadRunner Cable
·BroadVoice

Re: Ummm

said by BillRoland See Profile :

said by gdm See Profile :

Is that notification via a SMS? Typically most AIM people get notified via SMS when they get a text and AIM is set to the mobile device.

Usually your IM app on a device will time out after so long if you aren't actively using it.
No. There's an AIM application that runs in the background. When somebody sends me an IM, I feel it vibrate and/or hear a tone, and see the AIM icon at the top of the screen. Its not SMS at all, and I'm not charged a dime for it outside of the BlackBerry plan, its all packet data.
I have also been using BB AIM for years, and I kind of laughed when the iPhone version of this "revolutionary" service was released. In either case, I hardly ever use SMS now with BBM, AIM, and Google Talk on my Blackberry.
--
"You're Welcome"
-The United States of America and our Armed Forces-

Keeping the world safe since 1776

sivran
Long Live The Suite
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Arlington, TX
clubs:
·RoadRunner Cable

Same for my aging sidekick 3, on which all messaging, IM, SMS, and email, is equal. I get an alert (noise, buzz, or light depending on sound settings) and an icon.

From the description, it sounds like the AIM iphone client will do what I hate when PC clients do: pop up in front of your face. (in part or in full)
--
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon profitable cause...

wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace

join:2004-08-07
New York, NY
·Verizon FIOS
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·RoadRunner Cable
·BroadVoice

said by gdm See Profile :

Usually your IM app on a device will time out after so long if you aren't actively using it.
Nope, on Blackerries it runs in the background until you either use it or your battery dies!

badtrip
East Bay
Premium
join:2004-03-20
Albany, CA
·Unwired Ltd
·Comcast

said by BillRoland See Profile :

I get a notification when somebody sends me an AIM or MSN message on my BlackBerry 8350i, this seems hardly revolutionary?
That's what i was saying. My G1 has had google talk, aim, yahoo and windows live messenger from the get-go.

djrobx

join:2000-05-31
Valencia, CA
·PHONE POWER
·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T CallVantage
·Time Warner VOIP
·RoadRunner Cable

Push IM is revolutionary to the iPhone. Formerly closing the AIM app would cause AIM to log out, making it less than ideal for text replacement.

Keep in mind the iPhone doesn't multitask third party apps, so AIM would close if you tried to browse the web or place a call.

Now, it's not such a problem.
--
AT&T U-Hearse
Your funeral. Delivered.

See 9 replies to this post
kennyhuang

join:2002-02-01
Alhambra, CA

I use it too

I am love to have it on my iPod Touch. It's great app.

See 6 replies to this post

Eat Me

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ

Blackberry messenger and google talk

I use both on my blackberry. Works GREAT. Better than paying 20 cents per text message.

Why pay for an expensive data plan then pay for text messaging? Highway robbery is why.
MichaelWacey
OwlSaver
Premium
join:2005-01-30
Berwyn, PA
·Verizon FIOS
·Comcast

They should be Dumb Pipes

All the value added services that terrestrial and wireless carriers sell only add value to their stock holders. Just like the highway system, there should be one open and connected pipe that any application (like a car on a highway) can run on.

The current system is so messed up and counter productive. If the carriers do not do this on their own, the governments of the world should force them to. Vertical integration is a bad thing for consumers.

The current system would be like buying road use from verizon and you get a discounted car from them and you have to buy gas from them.

Tomek
Premium
join:2002-01-30
Brooklyn, NY

Nothing New

G1 and blackberry had those services.
--
Semper Fi
nnaarrnn

join:2004-09-30
Nitro, WV
·Vonage
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Suddenlink

Re: Nothing New

said by Tomek See Profile :

G1 and blackberry had those services.
And Windows Mobile has had it since what? 2001? I love it when itards are like "omg my phone makes calls now...omg!"

tiger72
SexaT duorP
Premium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
clubs:

Re: Nothing New

as have all Java-capable phones.

Has no-one heard of all the J2ME apps out there?

PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
Premium
join:2005-01-03
·CableOne

Not new

This is not a new concept to most cellular devices. I've been using MSN/Windows Live on my cellphones for years. I first had it on my old Nokia flip phone. Then, on my Windows Mobile phone. Now on my BlackBerry Curve.

When you get an IM, it notifies you that you have a new IM. On BlackBerry, it even lists the conversation in your message list, along with your SMS and email.

I've been using this to have lengthy text conversations with friends for years (when voice isn't possible or practical). Sure, I do have unlimited SMS, but when trying to chat in real time, Windows Live is much easier.

Leave it to AOL and Apple to take a concept that is years-old and market it as a great new idea. Oh, and they CHARGE for the ad-free version! HA! I've never paid a cent for Windows Live!
--
I'm one of those people you can't take out of context. You have to see the whole me before I begin to make any sense.

DaveNJ
No Fear

join:1999-09-01
New Jersey

fring

I have be doing this on fring, and some others for months. There are so many ways around sms, it hard to even list them.

mod_wastrel

join:2008-03-28
·magicjack.com

The only good ISP...

is a "dumb" ISP. (Dear ISP execs: your customers don't pay for Internet access so they can get to your "content". People don't get phone service so they can call their phone company--which is typically the last place they ever want to call. People don't buy cars so they can drive to their dealer. Get the point? Try not to be too "smart" for your own good. Just provide the service that you're promoting and selling. Oh, and don't treat your customers like they're idiots.)

gigahurtz
Premium
join:2001-10-20
Palm Coast, FL
clubs:
·Earthlink Cable Mo..
·VoicePulse

It's nice but..

it doesn't replace SMS just yet. I would LOVE to cancel my unlimited text plan with AT&T at $20 a month. I tried recently with the use of TextFree Unlimited, but the app doesn't run well on EDGE (which is all I have in this area, unfortunately). When something worth using on a regular basis comes out, I will cancel my text plan in a heart beat. I am tired of paying an extra $20 a month for SMS. It's not absolutely necessary, but it is very convenient for those quick messages to family and friends.
tenorsaw1

join:2003-07-10
Brooklyn, NY
·ViaTalk

Blackberry has its drawbacks as well...

It's funny how long the Blackberry has been around and it doesn't even do true IMAP. You can't even view your IMAP folders using BIS. It's nice being able to view all my folders in gMail. All most people care about is getting push when in reality they are really getting shortchanged.

Heck, BB's just recently started getting HTML email. Give me my iPhone any day over the BB.
stufried
Premium
join:2003-10-13
·Verizon BroadbandA..

Re: Blackberry has its drawbacks as well...

Speaking for myself, I have Blackberry for the international data plan. Give me an iPhone with unlimited overseas data and I'll consider switching. My wife uses a Blackberry because it is the only platform her company supports. I don't think the Blackberry is the best consumer device, but ATT has expressly noted on my account that I can stream Pandora anywhere in the world on my account at no extra cost.

I agree that iMAP on a Blackberry sucks. My wife's personal account is also an Exchange Account and we are using Astrasync which is also imperfect solution, but is better than iMap. My personal account is a Google Mail account and the free Google client is great.

I text message over Google Voice and it is great. If I had an iPhone, there is a $2.95 app that makes the Google Voice SMSes push messages that go right into your inbox. You need a separate client for outbound.
tenorsaw1

join:2003-07-10
Brooklyn, NY
·ViaTalk

Re: Blackberry has its drawbacks as well...

said by stufried See Profile :

Speaking for myself, I have Blackberry for the international data plan. Give me an iPhone with unlimited overseas data and I'll consider switching. My wife uses a Blackberry because it is the only platform her company supports. I don't think the Blackberry is the best consumer device, but ATT has expressly noted on my account that I can stream Pandora anywhere in the world on my account at no extra cost.

I agree that iMAP on a Blackberry sucks. My wife's personal account is also an Exchange Account and we are using Astrasync which is also imperfect solution, but is better than iMap. My personal account is a Google Mail account and the free Google client is great.

I text message over Google Voice and it is great. If I had an iPhone, there is a $2.95 app that makes the Google Voice SMSes push messages that go right into your inbox. You need a separate client for outbound.
I'm looking at Astrasync now since you mentioned it. I do use a BB for work and it is a pretty horrible device for consumer use. Don't expect RIM to tell you that, however. They better continue taking advantage of the fact that the iPhone isn't all all carriers, so does at&t because as soon as that happens both companies will lose a lot of customers.
Walter Dnes

join:2008-01-27
Thornhill, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..

BTW, it's 140 bytes, not 160

The SMS buffer is actually 140 bytes. 140 bytes * 8 bits/byte = 1120 bits. In English-speaking North America, the 7-bit ASCII character set is sufficient for our needs. Using 7 bits, we can squeeze 1120 / 7 = 160 CHARACTERS into the 140-byte buffer. In Europe, where you run into accented characters, Pound-sign, Euro-sign, etc, they use 8 bits per character. That allows 140 CHARACTERS in their SMS messages. Pity poor Asia, with double-byte characters; they can only get 70 CHARACTERS into the 140-byte SMS buffer.

KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest

Re: BTW, it's 140 bytes, not 160

said by Walter Dnes See Profile :

Pity poor Asia, with double-byte characters; they can only get 70 CHARACTERS into the 140-byte SMS buffer.
Yeah, but in Asia, aren't many characters like a whole word here?
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini

sms

@net.il

sms

Instant messaging is important but don't forget the sms messages. Sms messages are here and they will stay a long time because new services are added all the time like the text2land.com service to send sms to a landline phones.
Forums » Push IM Clients Challenge SMS


Sunday, 08-Nov 01:51:01 Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Hosting by www.nac.net - DSL,Hosting & Co-lo | feedback | contact
over 10 years online! © 1999-2009 dslreports.com.